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Push Pull Beta Test, The reviews

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Push Pull Beta Test, The reviews
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The submit button isn't working on this site, so please send your opinions and findings about the Push-Pull/ Hybrid string sets to jagwirestrings@inbox.com
 
 
These are the responses we got back on the Push-Pull/Hybrid Beta Sets.
 
If you sent a response and it isn't here, we didn't edit it out, we lost it.  The submission engine wasn't working right.
 
So, if your response isn't here, please send it to the email address above.
 
We know there are some lost, because we sent out sets to 53 players, and we can only count responses from 18.
 
(I didn't realize the engine wasn't working for about a month, sorry, Regina)
 
Anyway, the only editing on these is taking out addresses and personal contact info, so this is what your fellow players think directly in their words.
 
 

Hi Danny and Regina, I have tested the strings you sent me for the push
pull.  I put them on my 1967 D10 Emmons.  I have always personally used
nickel strings so I put a new set of JC6-15N's on the C6th at the same
 time.
I first must admit that I was not expecting the gauges in the test set
 of E9th to suit me.  First off, the .015 4th string was a surprise that I
didn't think I would like.  I have also been partial to .018, .022 and
 .038 for the 5th, 6th and 10th.  Also, I did not expect to like the .012 3rd
string because years ago I used a .009, then went to .010 and finally
 gave in to .011 and felt that that was as tight as the "A" note could be
 pulled without breaking very quickly.  However, I recently have been using
 your .0115 and like it very much.

RESULTS OF MY TEST:

The overall results are very good in my opinion.  For one thing I have
changed my opinion of stainless wound strings and will be ordering some
stainless strings Friday.   These do not have the rasp that I expected.
  The single most pleasant factor to me is that I can't hear any cabinet drop
 on the 4th string.  Of course that is the string that I have always found
 most troublesome as far as cabinet drop is concerned. I am quite happy with
 this set of strings and don't know if I would see a need to try the heavier
 set but I will probably try them since I am accustomed to the heavier gauge
strings.

Thanks for letting me help with the testing and you can put me down as
 being quite happy with this set of strings and will be placing an order for
 some for my use as well as for push pull customers.  I am also wondering if
 a .015 4th string on a LeGrande might be a good idea as I am convinced
 that the tighter string shows less cabinet drop.

Thanks,
Jerry Roller
10-20-07

Hi Danny,
 
The Push/Pull Trial Set has been on the guitar since early September and I've recently broken the 5th string, so the testing of the set as received is over.
 
1.  This string set has lasted well and has a balanced overall sound.
 
2.  The plain strings definitely have a more balanced sound with these guages, while maintaining their individual character.
 
This is most noticeable comparing the 5th and 4th strings.  The 4th string on my '79 P/P has traditionally had a treble "sting" to it, which I hear most when it's played after the 5th and 6th strings.  This condition is greatly reduced with your string set and I sure like that.  The improvement is logical, I guess, knowing that the 5th and 4th were formerly .018 and .014, and are now .017 and .015.  Good thinking on Jagwire's part.  I'm staying with these two guages for sure.
 
I was previously using a .0115 or .012 for the 3rd, so I didn't notice any difference, but I say again, the whole set is well balanced.
 
I'm not sure if I'll stay with .020 on the 6th or go back to .022, time will tell.
 
3.  The wound strings as expected still have lot's of brightness, just what I'd expect from Jagwire.
 
Thanks for this opportunity.
 
As agreed, you're welcome to use any or all of my statements made here.
 
Cheers,
 
George Webb
 11-29-07

Hello,
Sorry about the long delay getting back to you with my feedback on the Push Pull Beta Test.
First of all let me say that Jagwire strings in general are such a huge improvement over all other strings. Since changing over, my tone has improved and the string brakeage has gone way down.
I have been a user of the Weldon Myrick sets. I did like the heavier 3 string on the Beta set (.012 instead of the .011) My third string feels more responsive with the heavier gauge. I also liked the heavier 4 string (.015 instead of the .014). To be honest I wasn't able to distinguish much of a difference with the lighter 5 and 6 strings. However with the .036 10 string instead of the .038 from the Myrick set, I was experiencing a little bit of a problem. I have the "Franklin" pedal change on my 10 string, dropping it from a B to a A. The lighter gauge didn't seem to be able to pull it back to pitch quite as well as the heavier string.
I am looking forward to when you start offering the Push Pull sets. I will be a user of the heavier Stainless sets.
Thank you,
charlie_wallace
11-16-07

Regina, i changed my string,s to the other set of Hybrid and i like
 them and i thank you for asking me to use them but i would change the 17 to
18 =20-22=36-38. The 22 is PLAIN I think that would help but that is
just me. I believe they worked good on my P-P. Thank you==Jim Harper
11-13-07

Regina, i am fixing to change my string,s on my P-P. Have not broken
 any string but they seem to be losing their tone a little. They have been
great string,s and i like them a lot. They have about 60 hour,s playing
time on them and that is great. Thank you for letting me be a part of
your test and if i can help just holler at us. I hope i have helped  your
sale,s on Jagwire string,s. I have told every steel player i come in
contact with Thank,s again==Jim Harper
11-05-07


Greetings and best wishes.  Thank you for the opportunity to provide
feedback re: PP Hybrid string sets.

Opening the string packs I could see that there was no scale or
discoloration on the strings whatsoever. The plain strings were
 perfectly smooth.  All of the ball ends were beautifully wrapped with great
 precision.

The first thing I noticed during installation was that the ball ends
 had a slightly greater tendency to "spring" off of the changer finger pins
 during installation. This is not a problem at all, but an indication that
 something is different than my normal nickels..

The strings went on with no problem and tuned up and settled in very
quickly.

The guitar only required minimal tuning adjustment, at the set screws,
 and did not require any changes to the bell crank collars.  The pulls still
 timed out against the body and stop bar simultaneously the way they
 should on a good PP.

"Body drop" or detuning of strings adjacent to a pulled string is
 noticeably reduced from that of my normal set.(NICE!) Particularly improved on 5
 and 6.

The feel of the overall string tension is firm but balanced, just the
 way I like it on a PP.

The pulls balance out quite nicely.  I have always avoided the use of a
 036 on string 10, (instead using a 038) but on this set it sounds great, is
 easier to tune, and is a more balanced pull with string 5.  GOOD!

The set is well balanced in terms of tension and sound (timbre and
 volume) across the set.  The set intonates up the fretboard perfectly, and I
 have not located any wolf tones, undesirable overtones, or dead spots.  Most
 of the overtones I am used to (and like) are there although perhaps the
 primary tones are a tad stronger, for a more modern tone.  This may be because
 of the newness of the string, or perhaps the alloy. (I like the good
 overtones)

As I have noted with all Jagwires generally in the past, the unwound
 strings have a particularly sweet brilliance, that I like a lot.

The set sounds good and bright (my preference). Stays in tune, balances
 nicely, feels great, and hopefully will last. (I change monthly on
 average, more when I play more, and less when I'm lazy..ha ha.)

I  hope that the above input is of some value.  Of course please feel
 free to contact me (will be on the road for the next month as of friday) if
 you have specific questions, or I may provide any other opinions.

One last thing:  I use SS sets on my Zums (hybrids) and am wondering if
 you think these sets would be a good choice for them?  Also: It has always
 been my strong preference to use Nickel sets on the PP,  a) to be less hard
 on the fingers, and b) for a more vintage sound.  Nickel would be my preference if that  becomes an option in the future.

Thank you for this opportunity.   Regards and very best wishes,

John Widgren
10-17-07


From  Marvin Born
           
Emmons D10 push pull,   1978, cut tail   8 X 4  (black of
course)  Geo L  66 pickup
Amps:    Peavey 1000, Peavey session 400 (old style),   Webb
614,     Evans RE 200

Replaced   GHS  brand strings  PF 500 nickel   (no change in
pick up height


1.     These strings stay in tune very well compared to the
GHS strings,  probably by a factor of 1/2 )  I change
strings every month.  Average playing 2 hours per day.  The
GHS strings were about three weeks old when replaced by the
Hybrid Beta set.

2.     Less sensitivity to temp change.

3.     Much less bar noise,  especially on the low strings.
BJS  bar

4.     A number of people have complimented the "tone"   "
that is really the Emmons PP tone."  (WEBB)
" those chords sound just like a piano."  (WEBB)
"sounds almost like C6"   (Peavey 1000)

5.    The pick up output seems higher,  (maybe playing
style)  However,   the RE200 does not sound good on this
guitar. The L66s and these strings will over load the EVANS
tube input quickly.   RE200 has a 10 inch speaker.

6.    The string four lower to E flat (LKR) did not  reach
pitch  correctly, still  sharp at the end of the range. .
It required a change in a rod length to bring it down to
range. Then all was fine.  I suspect it was just at the end
of its range,  but it did tune on the GHS strings.  Just
FYI, not a major issue, unless a future user does not know
how to adjust his push/pull.

7.    The string 4 raise to F  (LKL) also require
considerable adjustment of the thumb screw under the neck.

8.    string 1 full step raise  seems to require more travel
with the knee lever. (RKL on the Emmons)

9.    Subjectively I would say these strings are a little
darker than the GHS,  but I like them that way.

10.    String 3 may require more picking strength,  compared
to the GHS.

These strings  seem to have a  deep rich, darker overall
tone than the GHS strings I have been using.  They still cut
through the 'mix" when playing with a group, but are still
not too bright or shrill.   Obviously, I like the dark
sound.

Some of the comments above were from Gospel steel players of
many years of experience.  You might consider marketing to
the Gospel market as well as country.

Thank you for the chance to test you future product.  I
suggest you do place this set on the market.   I would like
to continue to use them.  Do you plan to make a C6 set also?
M Born
10-14-07

Thanks so much for allowing me to be a part of the test.The strings perform
and sound great.But I still prefer the Sarah Jory E9 stainless.
You of course know the gages…Regards Bobby Boggs
10-01-07

Danny:

I've had the E9 betas on my push/pull for about two and half weeks and have had several gigs. 

What I liked about the betas:


1) I usually use the Weldon Myrick or Russ Hicks sets, which are heavy on the 5th and 10th strings.
I immediately liked the lighter would 5th and 10th on the betas as they gave a smoother and somewhat faster pedal action on the A pedal. 

2) The heavier gauged 4th string in the beta set is a big plus for the push/pull because equalizing the 4th string drop can be a bear at times given the travel that's needed to lower that string.  After re-tuning the changer to accommodate the new strings, I found that the heavier 4th string worked very nicely when lowered with the 8th string.  As there is less motion needed to drop string 4, I may be able to get a quicker 4th string raise (C pedal) if I recalibrated that pull. 

3)  The verdict is still out on the lighter wound 6th string.  I usually like a plain .022 gauge for the 6th (even though I don't lower a full tone, but only a half tone).  When I put on the next set of Myrick Jagwires, I'll let you know.  The .022 may give the guitar a beefier sound, especially with my push/pull which happens to have wooden necks on a mica body. 

4) No breakage!!!


What I didn't like:

1) The .012 third string.  Putting on a .012 gauge string for that high G# scares me.  I think the tension is too great on an Emmons scale length guitar.  I've tried that gauge before and it really breaks hard when it does break.  I think the 0.115 is the perfect gauge for the third string and I'd recommend going with that.


Overall, I liked the bet set and would purchase the gauges if the third string was changed out.  I didn't think the change in sound was drastic, but I thought the gauges complimented some of the unique aspects of the push/pull changer resulting in a nice, smooth action which is very natural.  I am curious to hear what others thought of the strings.

Good luck and thanks for letting me try out the strings.

Best,

Andrew Buhler
9-29-07


Hi Danny,

Just a quick update.

The PP Beta strings are still on the Emmons…. after 16 days they are still holding tone and I don’t know if it’s because I am playing a lot more than usual, but the separation is noticeable and I am getting some nice “round” character into my single note playing…. But as I said, I am putting in a lot more chair time than usual and focusing on my blocking.

But your strings are fantastic.

I don’t know what you are doing that is different from your competitors, but the difference is tangible.

When will you release them commercially?

Will you run them through the forum?

Thanks,

Geoff Barnes
09-28-07


Danny,
I had a chance yesterday to check out the Hybrid/Beta push-pull string set you sent me.  In short, they are fantastic.I never would've thought to use these particular gauges, but I have to admit they're superior to my usual choices in the past.
The .012 on the third string is especially nice.   It might be my imagination, but the overall pedal action of my old Emmons seems to favor these strings over what I had on it previously.  Anyhow...a strong thumbs up from me!
Thanks for letting me try this new string combination.  I sure appreciate it.
Jay
09-26-07


Thanks for the strings . I have had them on a couple of weeks now and
they sound fine , I had to adjust the tuning for the new gauges of
course , apart from that no problems . I can't say that I think they
 are better or worse than the gauge , same brand , I was using , but I have
always been a bit slack re strings and how things sound . My motto , if
 it ain't broke etc.
Thanks again
Brendan
09-26-07


Hello Jagwire,                                                 September 24, 2007
 
 I put your "Hybrid E9th" set of strings on my 1970 Emmons push-pull and played the Opry this past weekend. I will say that the tone was excellent as expected! Every string rang out clear and distinct and my pedal action was a little lighter. I found the "Hybrid" gauges  well matched and balanced and with the tone that Jagwire is noted for. You have a winner!
 
                                                           Steve Alonzo Walker
09-24-07


First of all...thank you for including me in the beta testing.  The strings were put on my 1975 Emmons D-10.
 
I had previously used the Sarah Jory Artist Series Set for E9th and C6th before the "beta" set.  Below are some of my findings:
 
1. Strings stay in tune just as well.
 
2. Was a little concerned about going from an .011 to a .012, BUT..I like the .012 better!  The true test will be overall string life (breakage, etc.)  Note...even with the Sarah Jory set I have NEVER broken a .011!!  I have extra .011's just aging in my pack-seat!
 
3. Even though the gauges of strings 5,6,8 & 10 have not changed, it seems to me that the "lows" are deeper..more prominent, I can't really explain why, but I LIKE IT!
 
4. I was used to a .017 wound and a .020 wound, but with the beta set, they are not wound.  It took me a short while to get used to that.
 
Summary so far.... I would definitely buy these strings for my Emmons. I will keep you posted of any future findings.
 
Thanks Again,
 
Bruce Etter
09-19-07


Thanks for allowing me to participate in the string test. I was really impressed with the feel and tone of these strings. The strings really enhance the tone of my guitar. They tuned to pitch without excessive stretching and stay in tune well. The strings are a perfect match for my Emmons push pull. I hope it works out that these strings are available for purchase.
 
Thanks again,
Larry Henson
09-17-07

Hello Danny,
                        I've had the strings on my guitar for a week now and love the sound. The guages are similar to what I have been using. The only two differences the 12 for the 3rd and the 15 for the 4th.
The 4th string 15 is no problem but I would rather an 11.5 for the 3rd. Will keep playing them and if anything else comes to mind will let you know.
 
Warmest regards,
 
Allan
09-16-2007


Hello Danny & Regina:
I have had the P/P test set on my 68 Emmons for two weeks now and they are just dandy. I really like the third string. I never tried to use a heavy string on there before. I get none of the  " sing " or whatever that sound is from a thin string. It make it a pleasure to pick any triad with the third string G# in it. Thank you for letting me test these strings. I will let you know how they stand up down the road. As you know i use nothing but Jags on my six string lead and rhythm guitars also. I have them on the D-10 MCI, the D-10 Mullen and all three Emmons P/P guitars. I also have them on four laps steels ,  six, eight, and ten string.
Thanks again...
                                                            Bud
09-14-07


Hi Jagwire:
 
These string gauges are only slightly different from I have been using for 5 years.... but already I like the sound of my 74 Emmons D10 better now. 
 
It seems to have taken on a thicker tone, by which I mean the guitar has a fuller sound than it did before, and the top 4 strings are more clearly defined that they used to be.   The 3rd string now has some body to it - I was struggling that one.
 
I have a 2-nighter coming up this weekend in a real smoky club....  I'll keep you posted.
 
Thanks!
 
Jim Cross
09-13-07


Firstly I want to thank you for including me in the push/pull beta test.  I have been using Jagwire strings for some time now. 

I have been playing  various  pedal steel guitars for 38 years.  I have been playing the Emmons push pull for the past 15 years.  I installed the beta strings you sent me to test and I'm sorry to say that I did'nt like them.  The heavier guages on strings 3 and 4 did'nt sound any better than the regular JE9-36N strings that I've been using for some time.  In fact, the heavier guages on strings 3 and 4 seemed to make the pedals harder to push and took away some of the push pull "feel" on pedals A & B.  I have been quite happy with the performance of the JE9-36N strings except the 4th string seems a bit "thin".   With the heavier guages you sent me the 4th string still has a thin or schrill sound.   I have used Jagwire .0115's on the third string and they worked really well and did improve sound on that one.  I think if you used a .0145 on the forth string that might work there (if there is such a thing).  The guages that you sent me were just too heavy for my guitar and adversly affected the feel on pedals A&B to my liking.   In closing I want to thank you so much for including me in this test and I hope I have'nt been to much of a pain here in my explanations.  If I can help in any way, please Email or phone me at (edited out).   Sincerely   Nigel Mullin 
09-13-07


Hi Danny,

My initial observations of  your Jagwire Hybrid Beta set for Push-Pull E9;
This set is almost identical to the Doug Jernigan E9th set I get from Jagwire.
I prefer stainless over nickel.
The only difference is the G# 3rd  @ .012 (vs. .011) and the E 4th @ .015 (vs. (.014).
In setup it required almost no adjustment.. my raises and lowers were stable and required virtually no tweaking.

New strings always sound fantastic and these were no exception. The slightly heavier gauges on the 3&4 were imperceptible to me, but welcome as these are the two strings most likely to break (the old 4th string snapped whilst removing it).

Knowing these strings are tailored to my Emmons Push Pull would make me buy them in preference to the Jernigan E9 set.
In playing they sound even and the tone is excellent.

Wiser heads than mine may give you a more technical appraisal, but as I see it, this set can only be an improvement on what I already believed to be the best string in the marketplace.

I’ll give you another report in a week or so after the strings have mellowed a touch.

In the interim, if you have any questions regarding specific information pertinent to your needs. Please feel free to drop me a line.

Kind regards,
Geoff Barnes
09-13-07


Played my Hybrid string,s again last night and they are doing great. I
have not had any problem with them. The string,s seem,s softer if that
is the right word. They sound great on my P-P. Thank you Jagwire==Jim
Harper
09-12-07

Thanks for sending the Jagwire Hybrid Strings. I am really digging them on my 1976 D-10 w/ stock 18K Emmons single coils (think Weldon Myrick) Wait a minute - this is Weldon's guitar - his last Opry push-pull which I had the good fortune of buying from him. Obviously, Weldon sounded much, much, much better on this guitar than I ever will - but not because of these Jagwire strings!

The Jagwire Hybrid strings look good right out of the pack. The first thing I noticed was the quality of the wraps especially on the unwound strings. It's very clear these strings are designed specifically for pedal steel as opposed to guitar strings packaged up into pedal steel gauges with the a picture of a Pedal Steel on the pack. I guess that says I'm behind the times in Pedal Steel string technology. Thanks for the glimpse into the future.

Now to the hybrid gauges. Two things: upping the gauge on the 4th string high "E" from a .014 to a .015 thickens up tone when playing the 5th and 4th string together. The same goes for playing the 4th and 3rd string together. Push-Pulls tend to sound bright and sometimes …….thin. Thicker tone and a wider sound means, to me, better intonation. The heavier .015 also eliminates the buzzing on the 4th string. Buzzing on the high "E" is inherent in the Push-Pull as the string wears a groove into the finger of the push-pull changer. (Now where here did I put that Simichrome?) Nickel strings are easier on the changer. Someday, I'll make the switch from stainless to nickel as almost all my steel playing friends/competitors have done.

Upping the high G# from .011 to .012 vastly improves playing the 5th and 3rd string together. I made a New Years resolution to practice and play more above the 12th fret. The .012 makes an in your face improvement up there in John Hugheyland both in tone and intonation. Makes me want to play more and that's what it's all about.

If I’m hearing what I think I'm hearing, these strings will record well with a full tone and better intonation. I will find out soon. My ’76 has a deep sound. It’s a commercial guitar. I also have a ’72 “Fatback” for the road. This guitar has more of the classic bright Emmons midrange sound. I’ve put 20K humbuckers on it but it still needs something for these old ears. I’m going to try some Hybrids on it. I think it will fatten up the ’72 where it needs to be.

Thanks again for including me in the Jagwire Push-Pull Hybrid Beta.

Bob Kramer
09-11-07


Hi Danny,

I thought I would give you my first impression after trying the new Jagwire Hybrid set on my ’65 Emmons wraparound. I liked the balance of all the strings with two exceptions. The second string seems louder than it’s neighbors and the 10th string feels a little “loose” and not as solid sounding or as loud as I am used to. The entire set feels a little looser than my standard set. I think I would get used to that though. I really like where the 9th string sits in level and tone compared to 5 & 6.

I played them for hour and the balance may change as they wear in a little more. I will give you another report after the wear in period.

TC
09-09-07